| New race, I think its a hybrid tho... (split off) |
Thu, 01 September 2005 20:16  |
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 dethdukk |
 | Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 200
Registered: June 2005 | |
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New race, I think its a hybrid tho...
IT
NRSE
NAS
.96 - 2.00
Immune
55 - 89
18% growth
1/10 habitable
1/1600
15/10
8/1
18/10000
check for costs 1 less
10/10
3/1
15/10000
weap. and con. normal, rest expensive
no check for start at 3
If you cannot love, you will always hate, and in hate there is only death.
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| Re: Is HP IT possible? |
Thu, 01 September 2005 21:15  |
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| dethdukk wrote on Fri, 02 September 2005 10:16 |
New race, I think its a hybrid tho...
IT
NRSE
NAS
.96 - 2.00
Immune
55 - 89
18% growth
1/10 habitable
1/1600
15/10
8/1
18/10000
check for costs 1 less
10/10
3/1
15/10000
weap. and con. normal, rest expensive
no check for start at 3
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The usual convention to describe economy settings is:
<efficiency>/<cost>/<operated> <g cost> 
So your economy settings could be concisely described as:
1/1600
15/8/18 3g
10/3/15
Which (I find) is a little easier to compare  
I think this race might find itself short on germanium in the early/mid game (until it gets enough super-miners up, which is going to take a long time), and the research settings could prove quickly fatal in anything smaller than a large universe (unless you do an excellent job of hiding your HP-ness.) And yes, it certainly looks like a hybrid rather than a pure HP.
If you change it back to a pure-HP 1/2500 you could free up enough points to make weap and con cheap, improve minining to 12/3/15 or better, buy some improved mineral concentrations (ever played minimum ger conc with a HP...) widen habs a little *and*, just to top it all off - bring it back on topic
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| Re: Is HP IT possible? |
Mon, 05 September 2005 20:26 |
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| dethdukk |
| Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 200
Registered: June 2005 | |
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I will run the duel, just send me your race with a password. My email is dtwillson-at-thegeek-dot-nu
[Updated on: Mon, 05 September 2005 20:27]
If you cannot love, you will always hate, and in hate there is only death.
[img]http://dragcave.net/image/XIJh.gif[/img] <--- is teh dragon!Report message to a moderator
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Wed, 21 September 2005 18:43 |
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My race had overtaken in resources by PPS at 2420, although was behind in research. This was exactly what I was expecting from spreadsheeting.
I did not have the Iron problems my opponent had, because I had 40% more from the efficiency. I handled all my early - mid expansion using the HW minerals alone.
My colonies developed extremely quickly because of the large quantities of G I was able to export from the HW (again, 14 eff.)
I also found slightly more planets, but this was also expected due to wider habs. In fact I only ever found about 1 in 9 greens despite 1 in 7 habs 
IT
NRSE, CE, OBRM, NAS, ISB
Grav: 0.24g to 1.80g
Temp: Immune
Rad: 16mR to 40mR
PGR 17%, 1 in 7
Eff 1 in 2500
15/7/21 4g facs
14/3/15 mines
Weap cheap, rest expensive, no start at 3.
1 leftover point to concentrations
If I played the race again I'd probably try to make con at least normal. I think I'd keep ISB - I didn't build many gates(!) this game so the 20% saving isn't so importnat, however it's real value is in providing a cheap effective defense platform for the early years so you aren't such an easy target for HG races.
I think this race might even do OK in a duel with a HG race, but I don't think I want to test that theory right now
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Wed, 21 September 2005 19:08 |
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| mazda wrote on Wed, 21 September 2005 23:49 |
That's quite early for it to be obviously worse than a standard HP.
With the 15/8 factory settings and the 50% more resources from pop you will initially grow quicker than the HP.
The HP should only start to catch you up when all your factories are maxing to pop.
Maybe it was a combination of low hab *and* the 1/1600 pop resources ?
What hab/race did Dogthinkers take ?
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I've posted the race and some comments above. I think it's fairly typical, but then I haven't spent much time reseaching them. I did spend a fair amount of time thinking about speed, so it may be a little faster than average...
The result was very clear. HP was growing faster, had substantially more resources, minerals and ships. It was a little behind in tech, but this was because it was pushing ship production and had skipped some basic research (i.e. it only went to bio 2.)
hybrid - hp
planets 9 - 16
starbase 2 - 6
unarmed 24 - 72
escorts 27 - 130
tech 40 - 37
resources 7k - 11k
score 389 - 541
The secondary HW of the hybrid was about to be destroyed by a large fleet of cruisers (gatlings, jihads) and bombers. The hybrid did not have the minerals or resources to be able to compete with ship production.
[edit: fixed spacing]
[Updated on: Wed, 21 September 2005 19:55] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Wed, 21 September 2005 19:15 |
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btw - the 9 vs 16 planets looks like a massive difference, but I want to make it clear that this was a result of the other advantages, not the cause - for most of the game there was only 1 difference in the number of colonies owned, and I colonised quite a few yellows.
Shipping speed and rate of factory production were the limiters of growth for this race (as they should be for a HP.)
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Thu, 22 September 2005 18:53 |
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| mazda wrote on Thu, 22 September 2005 18:19 |
| Dogthinkers wrote on Wed, 21 September 2005 23:43 |
I think this race might even do OK in a duel with a HG race, but I don't think I want to test that theory right now
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I'd be happy to oblige when my current game finishes.
Your score looks very reasonable, 11k at 2438.
It is around 2440 that HPs start to really take off.
Remember that, by definition, a HP race is one that gets the most capacity out of a given area of space. That is it's ace card. It outproduces other races, eventually.
If any other given race cannot beat it for speed (at some time in the early game) then that race is not really competitive.
HGs, -f and QS would all grow faster over the first 30 years.
That is generally why people do not play HPs in 1 v 1 duels !
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Hehe, yeah, I don't *really* think my HP would do that well against an HG... Well not an aggressive one, anyway...
If you like the resources, then take a look at the universe we were playing in - small normal. In a denser universe (more typical for duel, I think) then the resources would have been substantially higher. Ramp up was accelerating at 2438 and was still well under capacity.
I was very pleased with the early performance I got out of this race, I'd be tempted to take something very similar into a multiplayer (although I did swear of 1in2500 after my slow start in one of my current games... That said I'm now ranked first there, so it paid off eventually... )
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Fri, 23 September 2005 04:29 |
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| mazda |
 | Lieutenant |
Messages: 655
Registered: April 2003
Location: Reading, UK | |
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| Dogthinkers wrote on Thu, 22 September 2005 23:53 |
If you like the resources, then take a look at the universe we were playing in - small normal. In a denser universe (more typical for duel, I think) then the resources would have been substantially higher.
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Heh, nothing is typical for duel. People just prefer packed because it is *easier* at the start.
I don't think that 128 planets, in small normal, between 2 players is that overcrowded.
You should get 10 greens, all of which would be good after terra. Did you encounter crowding problems ?
I guess that the slightly shorter travel times you would get in packed may help a bit, but you are IT so not a big deal.
With more greens available you would probably be spread more thinly, with not that much more pop to show for it.
But a good race for a game.
Hab isn't too wide to prevent intersettling if the option occurs, and can concede those middling to high rad planets in border disputes.
Immunity must help at the start on the first few breeders.
Might want to shave the mine eff down for better tech.
Do you think it would improve with ticking the g box for factories ? (e.g. mine eff 13 and facts cost 3g)
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| Re: 2500 eff v 1600 eff |
Fri, 23 September 2005 13:34 |
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I took immunity for 3 reasons:
(1) I like 1-imm too much...
(2) I knew my opponent had 1-imm, and wanted to stay fairly similar to his race for comparison purposes.
(3) 1-imm improves early speed and HP needs speed to survive early years. Perhaps you could drop it, but I worry that you might start to encounter limits due to pop growth as you do not want to invest much in terra and have only 17% growth.
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--- I reckon I could 
the race you just posted with a pure HP IT design 
Hopefully it will be quick enough that I don't get too attached to my empire before you bring it down in flames 