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What kind of Rogue? Thu, 08 January 2004 12:17 Go to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
In the HE tread I saw as part of a long (very long) discussion, someone suggest the use of Rogues with 4 jihad and computers rather than Crusiers with 4 jihad and computers.
This I guess would work due to being able to mount more computers on the Rogue. (will testbed when I am not at work)
Which leads me to wonder what other uses this ship could be put to other than a very stealthy transport ship.

So what do you do with your Rogues?
Joseph



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Thu, 08 January 2004 16:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sotek is currently offline Sotek

 
Chief Warrant Officer 2

Messages: 167
Registered: November 2002
Minelaying, minesweeping, skirmishing in general.
98% cloaking is acquirable with two UCs, shadow shields, and the chameleon scanner; this leaves you a bit of flexibility.

You have 2x2 GP slots, and 2x2 mine/elect/mech slots.

Beam weapons in the GP, and minelayers in the mine/elect/mech, and you've got a nice skirmisher.

It has 45ly penscan radius, so it can see things reasonably well, and it has 98% cloaking; it *can't* be seen very well.
Plus, it has minelaying so it can drop fields where your opponent least wants them, and it has beams so it can sneak up and shoot down unescorted freighters, minelayers, and other support ships.

Very strong skirmisher.

Or, as a nasty warship...
6 BSCs and no scanner; can hit 83% cloak, which makes it nasty to try to find, so it's good at hit-and-run, and you have room for 2x2 missiles, which will have *immensely* high accuracy, and a high initiative. Not a bad anti-starbase ship, and pretty good in the era before chaff is really cost-effective.


Alternatively, six capacitators and beams.

In either case, it doesn't have the for-ship weight of fire of a BB, but it does have a for-weapon power comprable.


Of course, SS can make some astoundingly nasty BBs, too.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 18 January 2004 17:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kotk

 
Commander

Messages: 1227
Registered: May 2003
I believe it was me who suggested jihad rogues above jihad cruisers.

The Jihad rogues (and jihads in general) can be meant only for rather quick and early war.
The benefits are more elec slots, more fuel, more shields and the ability to pick up salvo. All at one level lower construction than cruiser.

So if you do not pull that early war then use the rogues as minesweepers, skirmishers, cloaked scouts and stealth layers before nubians. They are better than galleons for these purposes.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Mon, 19 January 2004 14:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sinla is currently offline Sinla

 
Warrant Officer

Messages: 132
Registered: February 2003
Location: the Netherlands
What to do with a rogue... Well, what not to!! Bounce

one of my favourites: best engine, 3 ultracloaks, 2 or 4 minelayers, 2 or 4 of your best sweepers (or just lasers it you prefer), 3 gorilla's or better and your best scanner. One extra elecslot for maybe a jammer, in case somebody sees you? Only thing missing is speed 2,5, but pretty versatile, n'est-ce pas?

Or how 'bout 'my' Highway Patrol (name courtesy of MCV's Highwayman, just fancied the name Cool ): 3 Shields, 3 Ultra's, 2 Big Mutha's, 2 OT's, 2 elephant scanners, 1 RB and a jammer. Excellent sweeping, scanning and stealing (and it is jammed too).

What I didn't do with my rogues is use them as weaponsplatform, but that is possible too ofcourse Wink

my 2 cents



If you can't beat me... Run away...

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 22 February 2004 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mcvos is currently offline mcvos

 
Crewman 3rd Class

Messages: 7
Registered: September 2003
Location: Netherland
Sinla wrote on Mon, 19 January 2004 20:59

What to do with a rogue... Well, what not to!! Bounce

one of my favourites: best engine, 3 ultracloaks, 2 or 4 minelayers, 2 or 4 of your best sweepers (or just lasers it you prefer), 3 gorilla's or better and your best scanner. One extra elecslot for maybe a jammer, in case somebody sees you? Only thing missing is speed 2,5, but pretty versatile, n'est-ce pas?

Or how 'bout 'my' Highway Patrol (name courtesy of MCV's Highwayman, just fancied the name Cool ): 3 Shields, 3 Ultra's, 2 Big Mutha's, 2 OT's, 2 elephant scanners, 1 RB and a jammer. Excellent sweeping, scanning and stealing (and it is jammed too).



Always nice to see I inspired someone. But I'm giving the Highwayman design a different name in my current game. Not sure what, though.

My main use for the Rogue hull is the standard terror ship (cloaked, minelayers, and beams for sweeping and skirmishing), and as a platform for the Robber Baron (like the Highwayman). But I'm not quite sure if my Highwayman design is good enough. It has the Robber Baron, obviously, and 3 Ultra Cloaks, and what else? It needs speed 2.5, so enough jets to get there, but fast enemies will still be able to kill my expensive scanner. So what's the best defense? Lots of jammers and shields? Deflectors? Or just keeping the cost down? Or should I combine it wth the Terror Ship design and give it minelayers and beams, so it can skirmish, scan, and rob planets when necessay?


mcv.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Mon, 07 March 2005 02:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Robert is currently offline Robert

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 393
Registered: November 2002
Location: Dortmund, Germany
Just one more thing comparing a rogue to a cruiser:

the rogue has one less initiative than the cruiser, but it has lower weight so you can just put (assuming beamer designs) a beamer with lower range (say bazook instead of colly) on them.
This means you move last, shoot first - making it a nice counter in the early wars (problems with movement can be easily adjusted with jets in the many mech-slots).
The difference in costs for lower range beams is quite significant, and with this many electronic slots and caps they can hurt quite a lot, making the first shot even more painful...

Not that great, but nice to know...

(Want to increase my rank to have an avatar, so posting every idea that comes into my mind)

Rolling Eyes

robert

[Updated on: Mon, 07 March 2005 02:21]




2b v !2b -> ?

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sat, 22 April 2006 22:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jstahler is currently offline jstahler

 
Civilian

Messages: 3
Registered: October 2004
Location: USA
A great Skirmisher design for the end of the game is as follows:

2 USC's
4 AMPS
2 Jammer 30's
3 CPS's
1 Robber Baron Scanner
2 MJ
2 Ultra Cloaks
and the engine of your choice. Very Happy

Great for Skirmishin, sweeping and stealing.

I hope this helps

Jstahler

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 23 April 2006 01:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
multilis is currently offline multilis

 
Lt. Commander

Messages: 789
Registered: October 2003
Location: Edmonton, Canada
In facing Rogue threats, my biggest fear was relatively cheap 98% cloaked minesweaper/scanner killer. Not sure how minelaying would fit in as downside of bigger prize per catch and minefields give away position.

A cheap overcloaker could be nasty as would allow few frigate sweepers (or destroyers for minefield resistance) or to sneak into enemy territory before splitting up for the big minefield sweep. (As well overcloaker could hide conventional minelayers at times)

No minefields and unknown where big SS warfleets may next ambush scares the enemy.

[Updated on: Sun, 23 April 2006 01:24]

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 23 April 2006 09:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jstahler is currently offline jstahler

 
Civilian

Messages: 3
Registered: October 2004
Location: USA
I beleive the end game rogue should be a powerful sweeper This way the you can mimic the sweping abilityies of a large fleet.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 23 April 2006 13:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NingunOtro is currently offline NingunOtro

 
Master Chief Petty Officer

Messages: 105
Registered: September 2005
Location: Brussels, Belgium
multilis wrote on Sun, 23 April 2006 07:19

Not sure how minelaying would fit in as downside of bigger prize per catch and minefields give away position.


Minefields do not give away position, they give away presence. As you are presumably 98% cloaked, and you do not need to stay in the centre of the minefield to further feed it once it is created, you can move out from the center while still staying inside the minefield. Only make sure you stay far enough inside as not to end outside your own minefield if they sweep part of it, because then you will create a new one and are again more closely pinned down. Out of the center can be a big area to search if they want to. In fact, the center of the minefield is a dangerous place to stay because its coordinates are known and you can be directly targeted through them without the enemy needing to target the invisible rogue. I would use this as a very valid SS tactic to bind superior enemy resources to a task that cost us almost nothing. Being invisible is more terrifying if you let your enemy know you are there with a purpose than if he ignores the fact. He will have to lower resources and priorities on other issues to hunt you down, so it will hurt him more if he knows you are there.



If we were esteemed intelligent 'enough', they would have contacted us.
If we can not find them, either we are not smart enough, or they are smarter at hiding.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 23 April 2006 13:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mlaub is currently offline mlaub

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 744
Registered: November 2003
Location: MN, USA
NingunOtro wrote on Sun, 23 April 2006 12:12

...and you do not need to stay in the centre of the minefield to further feed it once it is created


Even this is optional. Your ships do not have to be in the center of a starting minefield. This means they get one more turn of laying, instead of your lay and move to another part of the field tactic.

2+ laying points are required for this, and if the starting fields overlap their center points, they become 1 field instantly from the get go. The center of the field appears between the 2+ ships. Therefore, your enemy might know the general location, judged by the center point, but will be hard pressed to find them.


-Matt



Global Warming - A climatic change eagerly awaited by most Minnesotans.

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Sun, 23 April 2006 16:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jstahler is currently offline jstahler

 
Civilian

Messages: 3
Registered: October 2004
Location: USA
Indeed

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Re: What kind of Rogue? Fri, 03 April 2009 19:00 Go to previous message
boomerlu is currently offline boomerlu

 
Crewman 2nd Class

Messages: 12
Registered: March 2009
I like the idea of early game missile Rogues instead of Cruisers.

The main advantage of the BB hull over CA is extra elec slots for computation/jamming to support cap ship missiles.

Rogue can get 6 computers vs Cruisers (4 max). Rogues lose out on armor and iron, but win in resources and elec (if doing a comparison of 4 comp vs 4 comp, Rogues get 2 jammers or possibly 98% cloaking to compensate for their armor disadvantage).

All of this 1 tech earlier than CAs. This, IMO makes for a better missile platform until you can get BBs.

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